/pt/ – Petrarchan

>>12309 Intended it to be pro-religion. I just don’t think this fella is actually religious and I think that attitude makes religion harder to stomach.

>>12313 I think many educated Westerners believe in some sort of higher power, but they don't actually allow it to influence their day-to-day behaviour. They're still functionally irreligious. I don't actually have anything against people who find strength in their faith in their everyday life. Most online proponents of 'religion' believe in nothing. Their worldview is best summarised by that fake Voltaire quote: "I want my lawyer, my tailor, my servants, even my wife to believe in God, because it means that I shall be cheated and robbed and cuckolded less often" >>12316 The Amish, Orthodox Jews and modern Muslims have zero cultural achievements to speak of, unless you count their sky-high rates of childhood sexual abuse. If propelling dysfunctional client societies of the secular mainstream to reproduce at yeast-like rates is an advantage of religion, then I'd rather everyone be an atheist. Western Christianity at least fostered stable, prosperous societies and led to the creation of the most beautiful works of art in existence. What do the Amish and Muslims have to speak of? >>12309 I think the tradcath/orthobro sperging that dominated online rightoid spaces for the last 10 years is just going out of fashion, and the posts are a reflection of that.

>>12313 Those who believe in God (Muslims, Orthodox Jews, Amish, etc.) continue to grow and thrive. The secular world is literally dying out, they simply don’t have children. It is proof God supports those who believe in him. Now, this is a reality of the world but I recognize that it doesn’t automatically lead to personal belief. I have no useful advice on how to make yourself believe. But for the sake of your people you need to do so. At the end of the day you are striking a deal with an ancient Near-Eastern daemon who somehow melded with the all-knowing creator. “I give you sacrifices (time, mental space, giving up things as per your laws) you give me power and prosperity.” That’s the way to see worship.

>>12313 Because they're not empiricists. It's that simple. 95% of people have never analyzed their epistemics

>>12313 a lot of people are wired to believe. it's that simple, nothing more to it. I used to rack my brain trying to figure it out, especially when intelligent people said they believed. they need to have a simple answer to function, rest of us might feel bogged down by existential baggage but people like that can't function without certainty in that aspect. they will fall apart

>>12313 I think many educated Westerners believe in some sort of higher power, but they don't actually allow it to influence their day-to-day behaviour. They're still functionally irreligious. I don't actually have anything against people who find strength in their faith in their everyday life. Most online proponents of 'religion' believe in nothing. Their worldview is best summarised by that fake Voltaire quote: "I want my lawyer, my tailor, my servants, even my wife to believe in God, because it means that I shall be cheated and robbed and cuckolded less often" >>12316 The Amish, Orthodox Jews and modern Muslims have zero cultural achievements to speak of, unless you count their sky-high rates of childhood sexual abuse. If propelling dysfunctional client societies of the secular mainstream to reproduce at yeast-like rates is an advantage of religion, then I'd rather everyone be an atheist. Western Christianity at least fostered stable, prosperous societies and led to the creation of the most beautiful works of art in existence. What do the Amish and Muslims have to speak of? >>12309 I think the tradcath/orthobro sperging that dominated online rightoid spaces for the last 10 years is just going out of fashion, and the posts are a reflection of that.

>>12313 I think many educated Westerners believe in some sort of higher power, but they don't actually allow it to influence their day-to-day behaviour. They're still functionally irreligious. I don't actually have anything against people who find strength in their faith in their everyday life. Most online proponents of 'religion' believe in nothing. Their worldview is best summarised by that fake Voltaire quote: "I want my lawyer, my tailor, my servants, even my wife to believe in God, because it means that I shall be cheated and robbed and cuckolded less often" >>12316 The Amish, Orthodox Jews and modern Muslims have zero cultural achievements to speak of, unless you count their sky-high rates of childhood sexual abuse. If propelling dysfunctional client societies of the secular mainstream to reproduce at yeast-like rates is an advantage of religion, then I'd rather everyone be an atheist. Western Christianity at least fostered stable, prosperous societies and led to the creation of the most beautiful works of art in existence. What do the Amish and Muslims have to speak of? >>12309 I think the tradcath/orthobro sperging that dominated online rightoid spaces for the last 10 years is just going out of fashion, and the posts are a reflection of that.

>>12316 its not a fair comparison because the world that the amish and hasidics are breeding like rabbits in is a secular one that was created with science and rationality by people who had non-religious motivations. they're just free riding

>>12316 Even within more muslim countries,there still exists population declines.Some notable examples include Turkey,Indonesia and Saudi Arabia.Fertility decline seems less to do with the religion and more so with urbanization.While religion most likely does help with the willingness to get married and have kids,its only really a slight benefit to the material costs of having kids to begin with.

>>12320 >>12332 I mean, sure, but there are many ways to fulfill our natural urge for superstition without actually being religious. I'm sure that even some of the smartest guys around subconsciously believe in gambler's fallacy and jinxes and so on in their day to day life. There are so many opportunities to project teleology onto the world that people could indulge in to their hearts' content, and still be able to stop short of these archaic desert prophecy religions. The only reason I really understand is if you were raised into it or at least have family members involved. But if you join an Abrahamic religion spontaneously without any prior family history you're actually deranged

>>12320 >>12332 I mean, sure, but there are many ways to fulfill our natural urge for superstition without actually being religious. I'm sure that even some of the smartest guys around subconsciously believe in gambler's fallacy and jinxes and so on in their day to day life. There are so many opportunities to project teleology onto the world that people could indulge in to their hearts' content, and still be able to stop short of these archaic desert prophecy religions. The only reason I really understand is if you were raised into it or at least have family members involved. But if you join an Abrahamic religion spontaneously without any prior family history you're actually deranged